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Avoiding Evil

“Lord, so many of your concepts and law are great. Being nice and being holy are great. I am thinking about the tyrannical managers who yell, shout, bully, threaten, and engage in so many despicable acts. Maybe they are on a power trip. Maybe they are mean. Maybe they are evil. How can anyone do well when there are so many evil people out there and a lack of justice?”

“You are 100% correct that there is evil and there are issues that cannot always be resolved by being holy or following the Bible. However, that does not mean that one should not try. You need to follow my laws. Others should as well, but we know people murder, steal, covet, and other violations of my laws. Just because someone else is doing wrong does not give you license to do wrong. For example, in the Bible, I specifically require someone to stop when they see their enemy’s beast of burden on the ground. One is supposed to help their enemy and his/her animal (Exodus 23:5). If I am so concerned about an enemy’s animal, then I would be that much more concerned about the enemy themselves. The reason is that when you help your enemy, you are showing love. If an enemy cannot respond to love, then nothing will help. If you see a colleague you despise, because they have wronged you and others, struggling at work, you have three choices- do nothing, laugh at their expense, or help them out. The first two options are bad. The second one is evil. The third choice shows love. Maybe helping them out can thaw the cold relationship and it could possibly turn into a friendship. Not everyone who wrongs you in the workplace is evil. Maybe they were having a bad day or misunderstood a directive. At other times you can tell evil because someone is willing to break the rules and not being concerned with others and what possible harm they might cause. That is the difference between an annoying coworker and maybe an evil coworker. Think about the difference between someone who does not re-fill the coffee pot and an executive from Enron who intentionally will destroy the lives of coworkers and investors. You could treat each one with love and holiness, but one can easily connected with one while the evil person needs to be stopped, such as alerting authorities to inappropriate behavior.”

I am sure the Lord knew how I felt about this one coworker, Jill, I really didn’t get along with her, but maybe I did not really know her, or did not try. I thought she might have used her beauty to get the assignment to cover a major news story. Maybe it was that she was almost 20 years younger and had a better connection with the young new editor. It also could have been envy when she received the assignment I wanted. Maybe she had earned that assignment or was a better writer. I was thinking she was evil to project my insecurities. I was being a jerk for all the wrong reasons.

“Sorry Lord!”

“Sorry for what, Sam?” The Lord replied with a smile that showed he knew why but wanted me to articulate why.

“Well, at the Christmas office party I saw Jill trying a Jell-O shot. She squeezed the plastic cup and the Jell-O shot out all over her face and dress. I laughed out loud. Now I feel so bad. I should have felt bad at that moment and apologized to her. Please forgive me Lord.”

“Several things Sam…. I also laughed. That was funny as all heck. I felt bad for her, but when she laughed at herself, well I joined along. It was the context thing Sam so when she laughed, I laughed and so did my angels to minimize her embarrassment. Sometimes funny things happen to both good people and bad people. If you do not know how to laugh at man’s follies, you will miss so many of life’s simple pleasures. I regularly laugh when I watch Impractical Jokers and Jackass on TV. These are my children and sometimes the stupid things people do require a good laugh…if at all possible, a loving laugh…but a laugh nonetheless.”

“Second Sam, while it is great to ask me for forgiveness, people should only ask me for forgiveness for things they have done wrong to me, plants, or animals. For a person, well you have to go to ask Jill directly for forgiveness. No one said it would be easy to be good, but it is not that simple to possibly hurt someone and then ask me for forgiveness. Those tough talks with someone asking for forgiveness are some of the best talks to helps someone grow as a future leader.”

I was hoping for a ‘get out of jail free’ card, but this would be one I would have to own up to.

“Lord, aren’t some things or actions so bad that you cannot forgive people?”

“This is what separates the goal setting of the generation building the Tower of Babel and other communal missions, such as how so many responded to the Covid-19 virus. When the virus wreaked havoc around the world people got together and tried to develop solutions, mobilized equipment, worked on a vaccine, tried to support our first responders, and other beneficial acts. Their combined goal was very laudable. In contrast, the builders of the Tower of Babel had a goal, but it was an evil goal. Their goal was to build a tower up to heaven to possibly battle or to try and become stronger than God. They were able to effectively recruit employees and had a common vision and goal. But as I said Sam, it was an evil goal even though they were on the same page- it was the wrong page. Thus, I had to address the evil and that was through dispersing the folks so they couldn’t do any harm. Imagine, Sam, if you were the general manager of Babel, Inc. Would you think they had a great goal to reach the heavens and be the top dog or could you see the goal was inappropriate and try to stop the mission?  I did not forgive the people. This was right after the flood, and I wasn’t in the mood to deal with rebellion again so soon after I had just saved humanity. It is hard to find righteous people who believe in a higher authority purely for love. They exist, but the alure of joining with others to do evil is so much more attractive for some.”

Up on the screen popped up a building with a sign on the façade reading Babel Inc. since 3000 B.C.

“Sam, truly righteous people are hard to find. There are righteous people out there and they make great leaders and great followers. Most people though are mostly good with some evil, or evil with some good. People drift between these sides, and rarely do I see people who are 100% good or bad. One of my favorite quotes about appropriate conduct came from Mark Twain who said: “Always do right. This will gratify some people and astonish the rest.”

I knew there were Biblical leaders who were evil. But I guess it depends on how we define evil. I thought that it wasn’t the leaders who might be evil, but the followers. I wasn’t sure if Nimrod, the leader at the time of the Tower of Babel was the evil one or was it all those who joined in building the Tower. It could also be that both were evil.

My curiosity was piquing. Was it Nimrod who was leading the evil charge and his people followed or were the people evil and he was just there to help them better plan and execute their evil intentions?

“Lord, how can today’s leaders stand for what’s right when there’s so much corruption in the world?”

“Sam, leaders also often listen to what others are saying and undertake the politically correct move rather than the morally correct view. The answer is to resist the temptation of “fitting in” and to stand for what you believe in.  I still am shocked by what happened with FTX and how a culture of greed could cause so many people to lose their morale compass. I don’t blame leaders for making simple managerial mistakes, as there is no single way to effectively manage. However, I want their decisions to be morally sound. I will blame a manager who makes an evil decision and forces others to execute that evil decision. People are held responsible for their sins, but a leader needs to know what their followers are doing so a leader is responsible for their own personal sins and the sins of their charge if they could have prevented such sins. A good example happened with your kids Parent Teacher’s Association where one of the bord members stole $5,000 from the checking account. The head of the PTA was able to spot the issue quickly and intervened. Imagine though if there had been 10,000 people working for the organization. This is often examined considering a leader’s span of control and what they could have controlled. The larger the span of control, the more difficult it is to effectively monitor others.”

The Lord stretched his legs out and then returned to his discussion of evil. “Sam, in the same vein, subordinates are not necessarily held liable for the sins of their leaders. I specify in the Bible that the sins of the fathers are not held against their children. Similarly, if a leader does something evil. The employees might suffer with a business failure, but they are not charged with the morale failings of their leaders unless they knew a leader was doing the wrong thing and didn’t take any active steps to challenge the leader’s actions.”

“Lord, returning back to the question of evil, is committing a sin always evil?  I mean, some sins are just minor offenses. I am not talking about murder or violating the ten commandments.”

“Sam, there are degrees. I specifically forbid false scales or tampered weights for those selling goods. It is specifically written in the Bible in Deuteronomy 26:13-15 and Leviticus 19:35-36. Why did I repeat that directive twice?  It’s to reinforce that while someone might say it is a small little sin to cheat on weights and measures, those sins add up and that is when they become evil. You need to nip evil in the bud from the very beginning. One day you might start using inappropriate weights, the next you do not worry about lost property. Lost property needs to be returned (Deuteronomy 22:1-3). See how it starts with small things and then it becomes easier to forget other minor rules…that is how sins start snowballing into evil. Thus, I implore people to be fastidious in not engaging in minor sins just as I feel people need to prevent major sins.  When one engages in enough minor sins that ends up moving from small forgivable sins to possibly evil.”

Up on the screen popped up an image of snowball rolling down the side of a mountain until it smashes into a wall. “Smash.”  There was no sound. It was like a comic book text bubble in massive letters. The Lord was definitely a showman and loved dramatic effects.

“Do you want me to give you a good example of how something can start out small and then grow?”

“Of course, Lord. I am learning- the more you can couch a learning element with a story the better.”

“You’re on a roll Sam. Let’s take Lot as an example. When he separated from his uncle Abraham, he went to the fertile Jordan plain and pitched his tent right outside the city of Sedom. Later he was captured in a war while he was living in Sedom. The next time we see him he is sitting at the gates of Sedom and ministering as a leader of the evil town. He had worked his way up from learning at the feet of his righteous uncle to being an outsider to being one of the revered people in the city. Even though Lot was righteous, he got close to evil. When nothing happened, he got even closer. The next thing he knew he was in the belly of the beast and needed angels to save him. That is how evil can steam roll someone.”

The snowball on the screen was once again rolling…but this time it was chasing a man down the mountain.

“One way to examine evil, Sam, is to see how evil people work. Do you remember the story of Korach and how he rebelled against Moses? (Numbers 16:19). In your notes it will be under our discussion of humility.”

“Well, Korach wanted the priesthood, and he rebelled in the desert. When Moses heard the dissention he went to Korach, who was from the same tribe as Moses-so he was family—and tried to convince him not to rebel. However, Korach did not respond. He did not answer Moses. This is the type of bad employee you might find with examples of pride and greed taking center stage over corporate loyalty. A subordinate can withhold information critical for a manager to do a job to cause the manager to stumble and falter. That is where doing something bad transcends into evil actions. That is putting a stumbling block in front of the blind and is Biblical prohibition. That is where a manager needs to know when to possibly be merciful to a bad employee or when to terminate them immediately for bad actions.”

The Lord moved to the edge of his seat. He was getting more animated. It was as if he was getting more excited about the story. Why not. He lived through it.

“In the same story, Datan and Aviram also rebelled against Moses. They also didn’t answer Moses. But while Korach wanted a share in the priesthood, Datan and Aviram wanted something else. They wanted a battle. They fought Moses because he was Moses. That is another type of evil that can be found in a workplace. There are “Yes” men and women and there are contrarians who fight no matter what. Managers have to get ready for that battle as well.”

The Lord stood up and his clothes turned into an army general’s uniform. He had the hat, dress blues, and all the medals. He rocked the look.

“When Korach rebelled against Moses, Moses took the battle to heart. How could he not?  It was a challenge to his leadership. However, Moses’s primary concern was not the attack on him, but how the attack would affect the people. Moses had faced prior attacks to his authority and leadership. However, a bigger concern was that Korach’s rebellion was a very public display.  Moses had prayed for the people when they rebelled with the Golden Calf, when they complained about the meat, and when they sinned with the spies. He wondered if he had another prayer left for the people with Korach’s rebellion. This incident demonstrates that sometimes a fight can grow and move from a personal battle to a public battle involving everyone in an organization. It also shows that when people rebel, a manager can only go and protect them so many times before the manager loses any legitimate ability to advocate for others. Going to the proverbial well too often can harm everyone.”

The Lord’s uniform changed into that of… well he looked like the devil.

“Is that what the devil looks like Lord?”

“Absolutely…not Sam. This is what you see in movies. Evil can be disguised as anyone or any group. The point I was making earlier is that leaders must fight battles against both private evil and the evil perpetrated by larger groups. The incident with Korach, Datan, and Aviram helps show that private disputes can easily spread into companywide battles pitting different parties against each other. Moses tried to reach out to Korach but could not convince him. Korach saw Moses’s attempt to be the better person and Moses’s coming to Korach as a sign of weakness and that is why he thought his next attack should be public. Sometimes when bad actors are not stopped right away, their attitude and actions can become contagious and spread like wildfire. The fire Korach started was so intense that Moses could not stop the fire on his own. I had to intervene. I cannot intervene for every manager, nor can I open the land under every jerk in the workplace to swallow them. Don’t even think it Sam.”

The ground under my seat started separating. It was only a couple inches…but enough to remind me that anything could happen- if the Lord wants.

“Evil takes many forms, Sam, and one more thing I would like to add is for managers to drive evil out of their organizations. That is the advice I gave to the Israelites in Numbers 33:52-55 and would give that same advice to any manager. If someone is a new manager, they will face a battle. That battle will possibly be quickly won by showing skill and compassion. Care needs to be taken not to be too compassionate- the Israelites did that with some of the enemies I told them to expel from the Holy Land. They showed compassion and as I said in Judges (1:27-33 and 2:11-13) the failure to expel evil will become a snare for the people and cause the Israelites to later sin when they followed those pagan customs. There will be those who will always be detractors and will try to undermine the manager and spread disease within an organization. These individuals need to be removed at all costs because they will forever destroy an organization and will do more harm than good. The Israelites can vouch for the failure of not cleansing the land from enemies. While the Israelites tried to be nice and not be hardnosed to those who hated them, the results were constant rebellion that eventually led to destruction of the Jewish nation.”

“Sam, many people say I am a merciful God who is slow to anger. That is true…but I also never forget. Managers should also be merciful and slow to anger. However, when they face evil in the workplace they should not forget and act quickly to address evil. A little pain now is better than a lot of pain in the future. It is like pulling of a band-aid…I should say what others say about pulling off a band-aid as I have never used one. However, I hear the cries of those who have done it slowly and the cries of those who take a long time-especially if they are hairy.”

The thought of the Lord tearing off a huge band-aid made my chuckle. Then I returned to another side of evil…the side of business greed.

“Lord, should businesses exist solely to make money, or if they should strive for a higher purpose?”

“Sam, when I told Moses to have my people undertake a census and give half-a-shekel, I showed Moses a coin of fire. Why, might you ask?”

The Lord was waiting for me to ask this, and it was not a rhetorical question.

“Why God?”

“Well fire can be the most beneficial thing around. It can cook food, give you light, and keep you warm. Fire can also destroy. Money can do great things, but it can also cause lots of problems. That is why it is so important to not let money corrupt, but to let it do good things. One of the key harms associated with money is that it promotes jealousy. Jealousy cannot bring peace. A warm fire…well that can bring peace. That is one reason why I recommended in the Ethics of our Fathers (Avot 1:6) that a person should make for themselves a Rabbi and acquire for themselves a friend. This is to get the unbiased perspective of another person. A sounding board to ask whether the coin of fire will serve as a good or bad fire.”

The screens filled with coins on fire. Thousands of them. With a great assist from the Lord’s special affects folks. The room started getting really hot. The only thing was the Lord did not have any special folks….it was just Him. The point was made, and the room returned to normal temperature. What the Lord could do in this room was incredible…and he did this stuff everyday all over the world.

“Moving on Sam, greed can be more contagious than fear. Greed can cause many a man or woman to face their fears and overcome them. This adrenaline rush can inspire them to keep facing their fears for the perceived reward. Thus, don’t be greedy. Short and sweet on that one Sam.”

“Is there a short and sweat way to avoid sin, evil, greed, all that bad stuff?”

The Lord stood up and stretched his legs again. He looked out the window and answered.

“How about this Sam- Seek good and not evil…hate the evil and love the good (Amos 5:14-15). We have to publicly praise and embrace those who do good and do the exact opposite to those who are doing evil.”

I know I had asked for short and sweet, but that seemed too easy…and yet to difficult.

“Another answer then Sam is having a rule book helping identify good and evil…I should say my rule book- writing it, learning it and living it. One of the major rules I imposed on any king of Israel was they had to write their own Bible and carry it around with them (Deuteronomy 17:19). The idea is know it, live it, and love it. Everything in a king’s life should be focused on the rules and following them. Every person, but more importantly a leader, needs to know the rules and live them. It is even a little more than that Sam. Every manager should read their own story in the Bible. It is their autobiography so to speak. It is the autobiography of the people they will rule. The rule book is also a story book, and everyone needs to have a story and to have rules. The stories help reinforce the rules and help prevent evil. That is why I had kings write and carry around a Bible so they should know that they always need to follow my laws. They should also separate themselves from those who violate the rules. Hanging around a bad crowd will only give the king a bad reputation. If a king does all that, then they will have a happy ending like all great books.”

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The Interview Copyright © 2025 by Gil Fried is licensed under a Creative Commons Attribution-NonCommercial-NoDerivatives 4.0 International License, except where otherwise noted.